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Apr 05 12:15:04 * Lensman has changed the topic to: Welcome to #knownspace
Apr 05 13:37:43 * rimworlder (~rimworlder@24.61.225.107) has joined #knownspace
Apr 05 13:38:07 <rimworlder> hey lensman - everyone!
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Apr 05 14:26:29 <Lensman> Hi RM!
Apr 05 14:44:08 * Hippy (~captlychee@122.104.111.185) has joined #knownspace
Apr 05 14:44:25 <Lensman> Hello Hippy
Apr 05 14:44:38 <Hippy> Good afternoon, Lens, everyone
Apr 05 14:44:48 <Hippy> LOng time no chat
Apr 05 14:45:08 <Lensman> Good to see your typeface :)
Apr 05 14:45:47 <Hippy> Thanks. Good to hear your simulated voice on this Microsoft Agent thing
Apr 05 14:46:38 <Lensman> So, do I sound more like Darth Vader or Pee-Wee Herman? ;-)
Apr 05 14:47:54 <Hippy> OH, Darth. I've got the pitch turned way down and you're shaking the room. Like Barry White if he were a Cylon
Apr 05 14:48:17 <Hippy> I mean, a proper Cylon, not the New Wave ones that are conveniently and cheaply just like us
Apr 05 14:48:19 <Lensman> LOL!
Apr 05 14:48:48 <Hippy> Has the Inferno been on?
Apr 05 14:49:05 <Lensman> I forget, were you the one who posted last month that you couldn't see our comments because of sight problems?
Apr 05 14:49:49 <Lensman> No, Rimworlder and we two are the only ones who've posted today.
Apr 05 14:49:59 <rimworlder> yay it works!
Apr 05 14:50:17 <Hippy> Yeah, that was me. Fortunately my brother came up and installed this speaking thing, so at least I can now hear what you're saying
Apr 05 14:50:20 <Hippy> Hi, rimworlder
Apr 05 14:50:42 <rimworlder> omg - ceylon barry singing "you'll never know..."
Apr 05 14:50:43 <Lensman> Ho Rim! (I'd say "Rimmer" but that seems rude...) 8-O
Apr 05 14:50:45 <Hippy> Still, I go into surgery on April 17th, so that may improve the ol' sight
Apr 05 14:51:17 <rimworlder> if this were some other chat, that might get me beat up - or get me lots of offers
Apr 05 14:51:29 <Lensman> Hippy, are you not using Micro Satan Windows?
Apr 05 14:51:31 <rimworlder> Rim or steve will do
Apr 05 14:51:41 <Hippy> What, a Red Dwarf chat?
Apr 05 14:52:14 <rimworlder> something like that - I tried to hit both sides of the divide - rabidly anti to rabidly recruiting
Apr 05 14:52:16 <Hippy> Oh, yes, Windows with Narrator running, and Microsoft Text to Speech agent to read the IRC chat
Apr 05 14:52:30 <Lensman> Yah, Rimmer is from "Red Dwarf", RW equals RINGWORLD, so I guess we'll stick to Rim.
Apr 05 14:52:50 <rimworlder> ahh - saw a few episodes of RD, but never got into it
Apr 05 14:53:23 <Lensman> Hippy: Well Windows has that "handicapped" function, I've never used it, but isn't it supposed to make all displayed text really large?
Apr 05 14:53:27 <Hippy> It's a good show. The classic example of a chartacter-driven show
Apr 05 14:53:47 <rimworlder> yes - I liked what I saaw. not getting into it had more to do with time constraints than not liking it
Apr 05 14:54:09 <Lensman> Oh, you've missed something great! "Red Dwarf" is truly hilarious, at least after the first season, which IMHO is pretty dull.
Apr 05 14:54:22 <Hippy> You can make the display lext large, but on a bad eye day that's not even larg e enough. And it's difficult to read at five words per line
Apr 05 14:54:31 <rimworlder> didn't one of the main character actors also do another brit com?
Apr 05 14:54:32 <Hippy> Yes, they had to hit their stride
Apr 05 14:54:42 <rimworlder> chef or something?
Apr 05 14:54:54 <Hippy> Indeed. Chris Barrie, who played Rimmer, was in 'The Brittas Empire'
Apr 05 14:55:04 <Hippy> Lenny Henry was in 'Chef' but not in RD
Apr 05 14:55:05 <rimworlder> see - I saw it, lol
Apr 05 14:55:35 <rimworlder> I spent about 7 years without television also - conscious choice. The marriage brought the box back into the house
Apr 05 14:56:02 <rimworlder> (I had no idea the day was filled with so many hours)
Apr 05 14:56:53 <Hippy> You got that right. Imagine how crammed with useless minutes it is if you can't read
Apr 05 14:57:05 <rimworlder> lol
Apr 05 14:57:09 * Hippy didn't mean that to soujd like he'[s sorry for himself
Apr 05 14:57:21 <rimworlder> eye trouble I gather?
Apr 05 14:58:11 <Hippy> Yeah... The cornea is rejecting and they are going to remove it and my iris on the 17th. Then another cornea graft which will hopefully 'take' this time
Apr 05 14:59:02 <rimworlder> oy and scary. my eyeballs keep stretching more and more out of shape - but nothing that bad. I'm still using the medical procedure known in layman's terms as 'squinting'
Apr 05 14:59:16 <rimworlder> good luck
Apr 05 14:59:26 <Hippy> Has anyone been reading Jerry Pournelle's site? He is also going through a bad patch at the moment
Apr 05 14:59:33 <rimworlder> yes
Apr 05 14:59:47 <rimworlder> but he's soldiering on
Apr 05 15:00:08 <SeanS> i would expect no less from pournelle
Apr 05 15:00:56 <Hippy> Howdy, Sean
Apr 05 15:01:04 <Lensman> Finagle, going so blind I couldn't read is my worst nightmare. Earnest good wishes on your upcoming surgery Hippy, and if it doesn't go well, definitely look into one of those machines that electronically scans a book and automatically reads the text aloud.
Apr 05 15:01:05 <Hippy> Rim: do you know what is causing the stretching?
Apr 05 15:01:09 <SeanS> hey... just ambled in
Apr 05 15:01:27 <Lensman> Welcome Sean!
Apr 05 15:02:17 <Lensman> I read a passing comment about "Something is growing in Jerry P's brain", but haven't heard any details. Sounds ominious.
Apr 05 15:02:34 <Hippy> I'll be doing all that, Lens, definitely. Putting off buying reading sofftware for the PC till I see whether i need it, as it's $1600 to buy
Apr 05 15:03:10 <Lensman> Ouch! Hopefully there's a government assistance program to help with such a purchase.
Apr 05 15:04:09 <Lensman> Rim, you have a private message.
Apr 05 15:05:49 <Hippy> Sadly, there isn't. Tax deductible $1600, of course, but still a slight kick in the hip pocket
Apr 05 15:08:04 <Hippy> If I suddenly seem to go silent it's because this damn TTS agent will occasionally lock the machine up. But I shall be back in a few seconds if that happens
Apr 05 15:08:07 <Lensman> So, what's up with Pournelle?
Apr 05 15:09:02 <Hippy> He has some kind of tumour in his head. They have been treating it with radiation therapy and it seems to be going well, but I mean, Jesus, it's still a tumour!
Apr 05 15:09:21 <Lensman> No flup.
Apr 05 15:09:41 <Hippy> He's been describing his symptoms to his readers. Including some pretty awful problems with his speech
Apr 05 15:10:15 <Hippy> No treefodder indeed
Apr 05 15:10:34 <Lensman> Wow, speech problems-- that sounds very serious.
Apr 05 15:10:40 <Hippy> And what has been happening with Larry's Fuch's Dystrphy?
Apr 05 15:12:26 <Lensman> I'm not sure of the details, or exactly what Fuch's is. I know he's had multiple health problems, not sure if they are all eye related or not. Last month he didn't bring it up, and as I recall when I mentioned it he said something like it was a bit of a bother, but not too serious.
Apr 05 15:12:32 <rimworlder> hippy - astigmatism - first the right eye, then the left, now both just steadily getting worse. and no - I don't have a blanket diagnosis - I've been without health care for oh, about 25 years or so now
Apr 05 15:12:52 <rimworlder> lens - I answered the PM
Apr 05 15:13:51 <Hippy> Rim: just zoom up to Canada and get them to have a look at you :)
Apr 05 15:14:58 <Hippy> I looked up Fuch's on oneof the medical websites and it's something that can be cured with a cornea graft. Since I now have 54 000 000 frequent graft miles up, I was goingto tell him what to expet if he gets a graft
Apr 05 15:15:16 <rimworlder> lol
Apr 05 15:16:03 <rimworlder> hip - I'm not worried about it. It ended my paintball career, but I can still (squinting, some of the time) read the ticker on the bottom of the screen.
Apr 05 15:16:29 <Lensman> Rim: Yes I got your answer, you have another.
Apr 05 15:17:31 * jim_stiles (~jim_stiles@72.28.194.173) has joined #knownspace
Apr 05 15:17:35 <rimworlder> hi jim
Apr 05 15:17:49 <Lensman> I think Larry had one cornea graft and was scheduled to do the other. As I recall he had a bacterial infection from the first. Not sure how bad or if that's cleared up yet.
Apr 05 15:17:58 <Hippy> That's pretty good, Rim. I never had a paintball career and my last game of 'Battlefield 2' was a bit of a disasster
Apr 05 15:18:34 <Hippy> Bacterial infection? Eep!
Apr 05 15:18:51 <rimworlder> lol - I started playing in '83, had a top tournament team for a number of years, yada, yada. top 100 player, top 50 team of all time, yada yada. but when you can't make those long shots anymore...
Apr 05 15:20:37 <Lensman> Well DUH I just now realized Rimworlder is the fan who wrote "The Tnuctipun Aren't Done"
Apr 05 15:21:05 <rimworlder> well DUH, I just realized I was the guy who wrote it too!
Apr 05 15:21:06 * Lensman has changed the topic to: The Tnuctipun Aren't Done
Apr 05 15:21:12 <Hippy> Yeah. Much the ssame in computer games. Once you can't see well enoughto shoot yourself in the foot, it's time to get out
Apr 05 15:21:46 <Lensman> http://www.freewebs.com/knownspace/alt.htm
Apr 05 15:21:51 <rimworlder> hippy - yep. the best team I played for disbanded at about the same time too, so I decided to "retire from my professional sports career", lol
Apr 05 15:22:06 <rimworlder> thanks lens
Apr 05 15:22:06 <Lensman> And I added a couple of illustrations to Rim's article, too.
Apr 05 15:22:13 <rimworlder> ooooo
Apr 05 15:23:08 <rimworlder> looks cool Lens. Thanks for that
Apr 05 15:23:13 <rimworlder> I hope it gets you some hits
Apr 05 15:23:18 <Hippy> It could've been a professional career, too. 'Gladiators' has just come bcak down here.
Apr 05 15:23:31 <Lensman> Yah, it sounded serious when I asked Larry about the infection, and then the next month... or two... it hadn't cleared up completely. That sounds serious! But if he can see well enough to participate in this chatroom, perhaps it's not as bad as it sounds.
Apr 05 15:23:50 <rimworlder> well, it was in the sense pro in the sense that the team was classed as pro
Apr 05 15:23:51 <Lensman> Rim: No, thank YOU for contributing the article!
Apr 05 15:24:04 <rimworlder> hey, I had to find something to write after paintball
Apr 05 15:24:52 <Lensman> I suggested to Rim that the Puppeteers relationship with their Companions might be another indication of genetic manipulation, but he didn't think that fit his thesis.
Apr 05 15:25:38 <rimworlder> lens, it might very well be a part of the whole, but I haven't yet figured out exactly how to integrate it.
Apr 05 15:26:13 <rimworlder> my thoughts were that if the companions are part of the equation, they're hiding genetic material in there
Apr 05 15:26:52 <rimworlder> and you know what - that might be the sole reason for having created them to begin with
Apr 05 15:26:53 <Hippy> I am so out of touch with these theories. I still haven't read Desinty's Forge or Fleet of Worlds :(
Apr 05 15:27:17 <rimworlder> Hippy: synopsis. the Puppeteers are the Tnuctipun.
Apr 05 15:27:50 <Hippy> Ah... Well, the idea has precedent, I'll give it that
Apr 05 15:27:59 <rimworlder> please xplain
Apr 05 15:28:00 <Lensman> Well, Hippy, best wishes for your eyesight to improve enough that you can read FLEET OF WORLDS.
Apr 05 15:28:09 <rimworlder> second that!
Apr 05 15:28:10 <Lensman> There's certainly food for discussion there.
Apr 05 15:28:56 <Lensman> I just read a longish review of FOW... was that yours, Rim? Sorry, I'm corresponding with too many Niven fans.
Apr 05 15:29:06 <Hippy> Thank you, both of you. It's second on my list after DF. I sort of feel I owe it Paul Chafe to read his one first as it came out first
Apr 05 15:29:08 <rimworlder> was it on sfreader?
Apr 05 15:29:41 <Hippy> (Of course, I have't read MKW 10 yet and that was written by one of my own countrymen)
Apr 05 15:29:43 <Lensman> Anyway, the article mentioned the societal implications from something so simple as the Puppeteers elimination (defecation) habits.
Apr 05 15:29:52 <rimworlder> yes, that was me
Apr 05 15:30:12 <Lensman> I mean, the review of FOW mentioned that.
Apr 05 15:30:38 <rimworlder> that little bit there blew me away. it was SO obvious, and yet it had never occurred to me
Apr 05 15:30:51 <Hippy> What the? What do you we know of puppeteer defecation habits?
Apr 05 15:31:05 <rimworlder> its in FOW - do you want a spoiler?
Apr 05 15:31:15 <Lensman> I found it quite interesting myself. "Only herbivores eliminate where they eat." Hmmm...
Apr 05 15:31:19 <Hippy> Oh, okay.
Apr 05 15:31:31 * Hippy hopes FOW will be on taped books one day...
Apr 05 15:31:54 <Lensman> Hippy: I dunno, do you want us to spell out all the details? That would be rather a spoiler.
Apr 05 15:32:05 <Hippy> Or if Ed turns up today I can quiz him
Apr 05 15:32:46 <rimworlder> there's so much implied by that passage: imagine being the puppeteer version of Crapper...
Apr 05 15:32:54 <Hippy> No, no. I want to discocer it all for myself. I remain confident I'll be able to by the beginning of June :)
Apr 05 15:32:55 <Lensman> Oh flup, I forgot to send Ed a reminder.
Apr 05 15:33:01 <rimworlder> oh nos
Apr 05 15:33:42 <rimworlder> lens - was it an ok review?
Apr 05 15:34:28 <Lensman> Huh, you're fishing for compliments right Rim?
Apr 05 15:34:49 * Fred (~Fred@68.3.85.55) has joined #knownspace
Apr 05 15:35:02 <rimworlder> no - honest opinion. I'll fish for compliments on the TTAD piece, lol
Apr 05 15:35:08 * Fred is now known as Fred_of_Worlds
Apr 05 15:35:14 <rimworlder> lol fred
Apr 05 15:35:22 <Lensman> You can see my very short review/summary here:
Apr 05 15:35:26 <Lensman> http://www.larryniven.org/reviews/fleet.shtml
Apr 05 15:36:31 <Lensman> I got a compliment from Ed that my piece didn't give too much away, which was my intent. I'm aghast at how many of the books secrets are spoilt in reviews and even the cover blurb!
Apr 05 15:37:04 <Hippy> Afternoon, Fred
Apr 05 15:37:08 <rimworlder> nice piece. I didn't break it down into 'two intertwined plots'
Apr 05 15:37:11 <Fred_of_Worlds> even just saying how many worlds in the Fleet is a spoiler
Apr 05 15:37:14 <Fred_of_Worlds> hey hippy
Apr 05 15:37:20 <Lensman> Anyway, Rim, you review was very thoughtful and I think almost 100% on the mark.
Apr 05 15:37:24 <rimworlder> thanks
Apr 05 15:37:48 <SeanS> yo fred
Apr 05 15:37:56 <Fred_of_Worlds> hey sean
Apr 05 15:37:57 <rimworlder> the review editor is Pete Allen of Creative Guy Publishing. He's a very good editor
Apr 05 15:38:03 <Fred_of_Worlds> thanks for the tip on the FoW chat
Apr 05 15:38:06 <Lensman> Fred: Indeed, that's why I was careful to specify only Hearth and "a few" farming worlds in my short review.
Apr 05 15:38:09 <rimworlder> but then so is Lensman
Apr 05 15:38:10 <SeanS> i have some errands to run... will be nack on in about 45 minutes or so
Apr 05 15:38:19 * You are now known as SeanLog
Apr 05 15:38:27 <SeanLog> back on
Apr 05 15:38:37 <Fred_of_Worlds> you're back on?
Apr 05 15:38:39 <Fred_of_Worlds> already?
Apr 05 15:38:44 <Fred_of_Worlds> that was a fast 45 minutes
Apr 05 15:38:56 <Lensman> Ah! Egoboo, a fan's feast. :)
Apr 05 15:38:57 <rimworlder> If I can, I'll recommend the next book I'm reviewing - Space Vulture by Wolf & Myers
Apr 05 15:39:00 <rimworlder> yes
Apr 05 15:43:23 <Lensman> I think it's interesting about how many fan theories there are regarding Tnuctipun and/or Thrintun which survived into the Known Space era. Of course, with the precedent of WORLD OF PTAVVS perhaps it's not that much of a stretch. Still, as I've said, one has to come up with a logical reason why apparently very arrogant species would hide. I think Rim came up with a good reason for that.
Apr 05 15:43:54 <Lensman> When I say "fan theories" I'm including one or two KMW stories where the author did the same.
Apr 05 15:44:33 <rimworlder> frankly I think that its just the basic concept of 'slaver empire' that fuels the speculation.
Apr 05 15:45:06 <rimworlder> add in a bit of 'ancient alien civilizations' and you've encompassed just about everything SF
Apr 05 15:45:47 <Hippy> Or people's desire not to see a good character get killed off. You introduce an alien species, devoea whole novel to them, and now nobody wants to believe they're gone
Apr 05 15:46:03 <rimworlder> hippy, yes
Apr 05 15:46:25 <Fred_of_Worlds> aren't ressurection stories a mainstay of fanfic?
Apr 05 15:46:32 <Fred_of_Worlds> as soon as anybody's dead . . .
Apr 05 15:47:21 <Hippy> Not only fanfic. What about Christianity?
Apr 05 15:47:34 <Fred_of_Worlds> Christianity isn't fanfic?
Apr 05 15:47:39 <Fred_of_Worlds> :)
Apr 05 15:47:39 <Lensman> Yah, the idea of an ancient civilization with advanced technology goes back much farther than modern SF. It's the Atlantis myth.
Apr 05 15:48:03 <rimworlder> LOL
Apr 05 15:48:03 <Fred_of_Worlds> And why isn't George Pal's Atlantis the Lost Continent on DVD?
Apr 05 15:48:08 <Fred_of_Worlds> I loved that movi
Apr 05 15:48:11 <Fred_of_Worlds> e
Apr 05 15:48:22 <Lensman> LOL! Hmmm... Carpenter got bedeviled for inventing an stfnal religion.
Apr 05 15:48:46 <rimworlder> Fred - that's what I HATE about the changing media. Some yutz decides that MY favorite movies aren't worth converting from video to DVD
Apr 05 15:49:07 <rimworlder> wasn't it carpentier?
Apr 05 15:49:30 <Hippy> Fred: youre not thinking of Irwin Allen's Atlantis: The Lost Continetn are you?
Apr 05 15:49:39 <Fred_of_Worlds> The other one I don't get, which I've bitched about on usenet, is films that show up with nice new letterbox prints on TCM
Apr 05 15:49:41 * EML (~EML@67.163.102.208) has joined #knownspace
Apr 05 15:49:43 <Fred_of_Worlds> and they show them ONCE
Apr 05 15:49:47 <Fred_of_Worlds> and never again
Apr 05 15:49:48 <Lensman> Thankfully most movies are now out on DVD, or at least most of the non-crappy ones. "The African Queen" is a very glaring exceptions, the Laser Rangers have been wanting to do that movie for years.
Apr 05 15:49:51 <Hippy> People getting zapped at the end of it with some kindof solar ray?
Apr 05 15:49:54 <Fred_of_Worlds> and they aren't released on DVD
Apr 05 15:49:59 <Fred_of_Worlds> that's it
Apr 05 15:50:00 <EML> Greetings and salutations.
Apr 05 15:50:02 <Fred_of_Worlds> George Pal
Apr 05 15:50:07 <rimworlder> hi
Apr 05 15:50:11 <Hippy> Howdy, Ed! We were justa talking about you
Apr 05 15:50:15 <Fred_of_Worlds> hey EML
Apr 05 15:50:19 <Lensman> Welcome Ed!
Apr 05 15:50:32 <EML> FoW ... I *like* it.
Apr 05 15:50:38 <Fred_of_Worlds> Around the World Under the Sea was a case in point.
Apr 05 15:50:42 <rimworlder> I haven't been able to find several good, old movies
Apr 05 15:50:48 <rimworlder> can't remember the titles now though
Apr 05 15:50:56 <Fred_of_Worlds> One beautiful letterbox airing on TCM, years ago, gone forever
Apr 05 15:51:00 <rimworlder> Hi Ed. Great job on FOW
Apr 05 15:51:08 <EML> Netflix has a susprisingly good collection.
Apr 05 15:51:23 <EML> Hi, Rim. Thanks for the feedback.
Apr 05 15:51:24 <rimworlder> here's one - Hopscotch
Apr 05 15:51:54 <Lensman> Oh? "Hopscotch" isn't out? That's another on the Laser Rangers' "short list".
Apr 05 15:51:54 <rimworlder> I've got a review up on sfreader, but had to confess that I have not read anything else by you - but I will be now
Apr 05 15:52:22 <EML> I found some movies on netflix I'd wanted to see for years -- and in a few cases, I would've been better off never having seen 'em. Og, well ;-)
Apr 05 15:52:28 <Fred_of_Worlds> heh
Apr 05 15:52:46 <Lensman> LOL! Well, you have to see the bad ones to be able to appreciate the good ones.
Apr 05 15:52:50 <rimworlder> I'm OC with many movies. the wife hates it when I quote lines back
Apr 05 15:52:56 <Fred_of_Worlds> I signed up for a movie package on COX last week. Getting Encore westerns, but also some stuff like IFC
Apr 05 15:53:11 <Fred_of_Worlds> was amazed they're showing 70s blaxplotation films uncut
Apr 05 15:53:24 <EML> Rimworlder: the SFreader review is yours? Excellent review. I happened across it last night.
Apr 05 15:53:27 <Lensman> And that's no joke. Until I saw Pendragon's "The War of the Worlds" I never understood how critical editing was to a good... or even mediocre... film.
Apr 05 15:53:29 <rimworlder> hey - with Obama running that might become a regular thing
Apr 05 15:53:35 <rimworlder> thanks
Apr 05 15:53:45 <Fred_of_Worlds> which is pendragons?
Apr 05 15:53:48 * SolBelter (~SolBelter@65.96.191.191) has joined #knownspace
Apr 05 15:53:54 <EML> Have I missed Larry yet today?
Apr 05 15:53:57 <Fred_of_Worlds> is that the C Thomas Howell version?
Apr 05 15:54:03 <rimworlder> no, don't thinkg so
Apr 05 15:54:20 * FlyingAway has quit (Ping timeout)
Apr 05 15:54:34 <Hippy> Well, Fred, I'll be jiggered. I've always thought that Irwin Allen. But according to the IMDB it's out on DVD
Apr 05 15:54:41 <Fred_of_Worlds> what?
Apr 05 15:54:42 <Lensman> http://www.pendragonpictures.com/WOTWKEY.html
Apr 05 15:54:56 <rimworlder> Ed - I don't want to know who wrote what, but I would be interested in a description of the collaboration process you two used
Apr 05 15:55:00 <Lensman> Has to be seen to be believed... that is, believe how bad a movie can be.
Apr 05 15:55:13 <Lensman> Larry has not beed in yet.
Apr 05 15:55:30 <Hippy> If your Encore is anything like ours here, anything they show will be on DVD
Apr 05 15:55:45 <Lensman> "been in yet"
Apr 05 15:55:56 <Lensman> (Ebonics beed very good to me...)
Apr 05 15:56:10 <EML> Rimworlder: that's covered in the interview at http://www.sfrevu.com/php/Review-id.php?id=6197
Apr 05 15:56:16 <Fred_of_Worlds> bad hippy
Apr 05 15:56:18 <rimworlder> lol lens - ebonics - haven't heard that one in a while
Apr 05 15:56:20 <Fred_of_Worlds> it's out on VHS
Apr 05 15:56:23 <Fred_of_Worlds> not dvd
Apr 05 15:56:28 <rimworlder> Ed - thanks, I'll take a look
Apr 05 15:56:31 <Fred_of_Worlds> you got my hopes up
Apr 05 15:56:39 <Fred_of_Worlds> now I'm all messed up inside :(
Apr 05 15:56:59 <EML> And then there's the Spielberg War of the Worlds. Gag. Barf! Puuuuuuke.
Apr 05 15:57:04 <Fred_of_Worlds> yes
Apr 05 15:57:10 <Fred_of_Worlds> to what ed said
Apr 05 15:57:35 <Fred_of_Worlds> changing the plugs in your car fixes EMP damage
Apr 05 15:57:37 <Fred_of_Worlds> gotta love it
Apr 05 15:57:49 <rimworlder> I may offend here, but I can't think of more than two 'based on the story' sf movies ever made that weren't blech
Apr 05 15:57:57 * FlyingAway (~Carol@64.91.205.157) has joined #knownspace
Apr 05 15:58:00 <Fred_of_Worlds> and after 10 solid minute of NO ELECTRICAL DEVICE WILL WORK
Apr 05 15:58:08 <Fred_of_Worlds> camcorders are fine
Apr 05 15:58:08 <Lensman> No, actually it was changing the soleniod. Science made DEEPLY stupid...
Apr 05 15:58:19 <Fred_of_Worlds> guess he had the springloaded kind
Apr 05 15:58:24 <EML> Enemy Mine was pretty good, I thought.
Apr 05 15:58:24 <Hippy> A very succinct review, Ed
Apr 05 15:58:31 * Hippy has quit (Connection reset by peer)
Apr 05 15:58:32 <Fred_of_Worlds> oh, yeah, soleniod (as in robots)
Apr 05 15:58:50 <Fred_of_Worlds> I preferred Enemy Mine when it was called Robinson Crusoe on Mars :)
Apr 05 15:59:04 <rimworlder> lol
Apr 05 15:59:08 <Lensman> Actually there were a number of very good things about Spielberg's WotW. Too bad they were so thoroughly spoilt by the stupid things.
Apr 05 15:59:38 <Fred_of_Worlds> there was gene barry and ann robinson at the end
Apr 05 15:59:43 <rimworlder> here's what I can't understand (I mean I do, but I can't accept it) why can't you just make the damn movie based on the damn book?
Apr 05 15:59:44 * Hippy (~captlychee@122.104.111.185) has joined #knownspace
Apr 05 15:59:47 <Fred_of_Worlds> is 'two' a number?
Apr 05 15:59:59 <Fred_of_Worlds> because, rimmy, and I'm quite serious here
Apr 05 16:00:04 <Fred_of_Worlds> Hollywood doesn't read
Apr 05 16:00:07 <EML> Blade Runner wasn't bad. And I liked the 1984 (David Lynch) Dune. That's three.
Apr 05 16:00:12 <rimworlder> WOTW took place in the 1800s - plenty of period pieces take place in the 1800s
Apr 05 16:00:29 <rimworlder> fred - yes, like I said, can't accept it.
Apr 05 16:00:32 <Hippy> Goddamn software causing peer connection crap or whatever it is!
Apr 05 16:00:41 <Fred_of_Worlds> The Disney Tarzan is a great case in point.
Apr 05 16:00:50 <Fred_of_Worlds> They watched every damn Tarzan film every made
Apr 05 16:00:57 <Fred_of_Worlds> but nobody cracked open the book
Apr 05 16:01:05 <rimworlder> EML - blade was one on my list - Dune definately not. the ending killed it for me. Rain on Arrakis?
Apr 05 16:01:18 <Lensman> Rim: I think movie producers think SF has to be dumbed down for a movie audience. Look at "Spawn"-- fer Finagle's sake, all they had to do was use dramatic elements from the comic storyline! But NOOOO they had to dumb it down. Grrrr...
Apr 05 16:01:45 <Fred_of_Worlds> I think movie producers have to dumb it down for themselves
Apr 05 16:01:46 <rimworlder> lens - I put it down to the wolf theory: they HAVE to piss on it, otherwise it doesn't smell like them
Apr 05 16:01:53 <Fred_of_Worlds> hah
Apr 05 16:01:56 <EML> The rain at the end of Dune was a metaphor. (A man's reach should exceed his grasp, else what's a meta phor?)
Apr 05 16:02:10 <Lensman> LOL! An ex-girlfriend of mine said "They just killed every sandworm on Arrikis..." at the end of that stupid "Dune" movie.
Apr 05 16:02:15 <Fred_of_Worlds> I thought it was an homage to the stupid ending of Andromeda Strain
Apr 05 16:02:28 <Fred_of_Worlds> or the stupid ending of Day of the Triffids
Apr 05 16:02:38 <rimworlder> Ed - I know. but for me it was a ruinous metaphor. they just destroyed all the spice and killed any chance of a sequel
Apr 05 16:02:48 <Fred_of_Worlds> LOOK! WATER KILLS THE PLANTS!
Apr 05 16:03:12 <Lensman> Hmmmm... I thought "Andromeda" followed the book pretty well, other than leaving out bunches of stuff.
Apr 05 16:03:18 <EML> shameless promo alert: I wrote short stories called the Day of the RFIDs and the Night of the RFIDs.
Apr 05 16:03:23 <rimworlder> and the 'sound weapon' substituting for uber martial arts skills
Apr 05 16:03:23 <Lensman> Did they change the ending of "Andromeda"?
Apr 05 16:03:27 <Fred_of_Worlds> yes
Apr 05 16:03:42 <rimworlder> ed - radio frequency...?
Apr 05 16:03:42 <Fred_of_Worlds> "suddenly it rained, killing all Andromeda everywhere forever, the end"
Apr 05 16:03:49 <EML> Umm, guys -- who says the rain was global?
Apr 05 16:04:03 <Lensman> LOL! Ed, where can we find those?
Apr 05 16:04:15 <EML> yup, RFID = radio frequency identification.
Apr 05 16:04:17 <Hippy> Ah, the ol' 'Day of the Triffids' Now there was a stupid ending
Apr 05 16:04:21 * FlyingAway has quit (Ping timeout)
Apr 05 16:04:22 <Fred_of_Worlds> same thing with the Triffids. LOOK! FIRE HOSES KILL THE PLANTS!
Apr 05 16:04:23 <rimworlder> Ed - I'm not going to argue taste in movies. I think we can all agree that Hollywood has not generally been kind to SF
Apr 05 16:04:52 * FlyingAway (~Carol@64.91.205.157) has joined #knownspace
Apr 05 16:05:06 <rimworlder> does anyone else realize that (Princess) Irulan is an anagram of Urinal?
Apr 05 16:05:12 <Fred_of_Worlds> although the all time howler in Hollywood history was last week on SMALLVILLE
Apr 05 16:05:20 <EML> Lens: "Day of the RFIDs" was firts published in the antho Future Washington and is in my collection Cretaive Destruction. You can get the standalone on fictionswise.
Apr 05 16:05:21 <Fred_of_Worlds> they're trying to find the evil robot BRAINIAC
Apr 05 16:05:26 <Hippy> Afternoon, CArol
Apr 05 16:05:37 <Fred_of_Worlds> Clark says "If only we knew what his power source was"
Apr 05 16:05:39 <EML> Oops: Creative Destruction.
Apr 05 16:05:49 <Fred_of_Worlds> Kara says, thoughtfully . . . "could it be . . energy???"
Apr 05 16:06:03 <EML> "Night of the RFIDs" is just out, in the May Analog.
Apr 05 16:06:10 <Fred_of_Worlds> Armed with that, they set google earth to display 'energy'
Apr 05 16:06:16 <Fred_of_Worlds> and quickly track him down
Apr 05 16:06:51 <rimworlder> brb
Apr 05 16:06:58 <Lensman> LOL! Yah, that was pretty stupid. Still, I think "Signs" competes for that. The aliens react to tapwater like it's concentrated acid? Umm... hey fellas, didja know our air has a significant amount of water vapor in it? Guess not, huh.
Apr 05 16:07:01 <Fred_of_Worlds> Based on that, the network fired the producers, and put the idiots that wrote that episode in charge of the series
Apr 05 16:07:34 <rimworlder> lol
Apr 05 16:07:53 <EML> Re Signs: and the aliens who navigated interstellar space needed crop signs to find their way around Earth?!?
Apr 05 16:08:21 <rimworlder> and the alien invasion was defeated with a baseball bat
Apr 05 16:08:22 <Fred_of_Worlds> I react to my tapwater like it's concentrated acid. I'll barely feed it to the plants. :)
Apr 05 16:08:59 <Hippy> amen to that, Fred
Apr 05 16:09:03 <EML> How could the aliens possibly know Earth had a lot of water? That's too hard a problem, surely.
Apr 05 16:09:37 <Lensman> ED: LOL!
Apr 05 16:09:39 <Fred_of_Worlds> obNiven: aliens that cruise past Saturn where the water comes prepackaged and nobody's shooting at you
Apr 05 16:09:40 <Hippy> Well, it was the luoride they wre reacting to
Apr 05 16:09:54 <rimworlder> well, look at V. they all came here to steal out water. like they couldn't find any anywhere else in the galaxy
Apr 05 16:10:25 <Lensman> Rim: Yah I'm surprised how many people like "V". I find it deeply stupid.
Apr 05 16:10:30 <Hippy> IFred: I always thought of that as Steven Barnes observation
Apr 05 16:10:49 <Fred_of_Worlds> might be. It's in a Niven collection
Apr 05 16:10:53 <EML> V was just a reason to admire Diana in her latex suit. Seven of Nine before her time.
Apr 05 16:10:59 <Fred_of_Worlds> N-Space or one of those
Apr 05 16:11:19 <Fred_of_Worlds> My favorite V moment was when the hot blonde Visitor took off her jumpsuit
Apr 05 16:11:19 <Hippy> The problem with questioning why aliens do things is that you assume they think like we do
Apr 05 16:11:31 <Fred_of_Worlds> and has a FULL BODY human suit on underneath
Apr 05 16:11:50 <Fred_of_Worlds> that was tied with the twin Visitors both wearing the same human mask
Apr 05 16:11:53 <Lensman> IIRC there's a reference to the Fithp space drive twisting one of Saturn's rings. /Footfall/.
Apr 05 16:11:58 <rimworlder> FOW - I remember that. IIRC, it was a loooooong zipper scene
Apr 05 16:12:08 <rimworlder> lens - yes
Apr 05 16:12:14 <EML> aliens can have different motivations than us. starfaring aliens ought not to be criminally stupid.
Apr 05 16:12:22 <Fred_of_Worlds> just criminal
Apr 05 16:12:34 <rimworlder> EML - unless its comedy
Apr 05 16:12:56 <rimworlder> Some of Eric Frank Russels aliens were monumentally stupid
Apr 05 16:12:58 <EML> rim: true.
Apr 05 16:13:07 <Hippy> I tend to ignore the series when it comes to 'V'. That had no redeeeming qualities at all
Apr 05 16:13:16 <Fred_of_Worlds> I was never sure what Ming the Canadian Accountant was up to in the new Flash Gordon either
Apr 05 16:13:27 <Lensman> Well, there's another problem I had with "V". They're alien enough that they can stretch their jaws out and swallow small animals whole, yet by just putting on a mask and jumpsuit they can pass for human. Umm humm... Right.
Apr 05 16:13:30 <rimworlder> I avoided that one entirely
Apr 05 16:13:43 <Fred_of_Worlds> he seemed to need water, which was flowing in great quantity through the city, but couldn't figure out how to purify it
Apr 05 16:13:59 <Fred_of_Worlds> any spacefaring race that can't purify water has missed a tutorial someplace
Apr 05 16:14:31 <EML> Very few TV shows or movies will spend what it takes to make a convincing alien. Witness all the humanoids on Star Trek (pick you iteration).
Apr 05 16:14:49 <Lensman> "Flash Gordon". Well, I forced myself to watch the entire first episode, but I've had NO desire to watch anymore. I can't even call it a "travesty", it's not that close to the real FG.
Apr 05 16:14:50 * Ronn (~Ronn@68.17.168.208) has joined #knownspace
Apr 05 16:14:54 <rimworlder> yes, but that's changing with cgi
Apr 05 16:14:57 <Fred_of_Worlds> you saying the Tribbles weren't convincing?
Apr 05 16:15:45 <SolBelter> that'a why the horta was so well received, even for being someone crawling horizontally .>> ALIen!
Apr 05 16:15:49 <Hippy> The problem with convincing aliens is that they don't act human enough to get any drama out of them. When they do act human enough to get any drama out of them people then accuse them of being 'too human' or 'humans in rubber suits', though
Apr 05 16:15:57 <Fred_of_Worlds> the Horta rocked
Apr 05 16:16:03 <EML> Call me a curmudgeon, but I hate Tribbles (and Ewoks). There's cute and then there's nauseous.
Apr 05 16:16:06 <Lensman> Someone criticized "Battlestar Galactica" for having Cylons indistinguishable from humans, but personally I think that's one of the show's strong points.
Apr 05 16:16:11 <Fred_of_Worlds> Kirk VS Lasagna!
Apr 05 16:16:14 <EML> Synapse mifire. who/what are Horta?
Apr 05 16:16:22 <Fred_of_Worlds> Star Trek
Apr 05 16:16:27 <Fred_of_Worlds> The Devil in the Dark
Apr 05 16:16:31 <Fred_of_Worlds> tunneling alien
Apr 05 16:16:36 <SolBelter> original trek - episode the cr
Apr 05 16:16:37 <Fred_of_Worlds> laying silcon eggs
Apr 05 16:16:50 <jim_stiles> ST-TOS alien: silicon based life
Apr 05 16:17:03 <SolBelter> eature that burrowed thru rock, killing minersr
Apr 05 16:17:08 <EML> thanks, various. the pre-Kirk pilot episaode?
Apr 05 16:17:10 <Lensman> It's very, very difficult to do CGI well enough to be convincing and convey emotion. LOTR did it brilliantly with Gollum, but how many TV shows can do that on their budget?
Apr 05 16:17:16 <Fred_of_Worlds> looked like a molten lasagna throw rug with a short guy underneath it
Apr 05 16:17:25 <Fred_of_Worlds> No, that's THE CAGE
Apr 05 16:17:45 <SolBelter> ...protecting the ggs from being mined
Apr 05 16:17:47 <Lensman> Ed: No, "Devil in the Dark" was a regular Classic Star Trek episode.
Apr 05 16:18:00 <Fred_of_Worlds> http://www.70disco.com/images/horta2.jpg
Apr 05 16:18:08 <EML> May I segue into aliens in the next FLEET book?
Apr 05 16:18:13 <Fred_of_Worlds> http://www.70disco.com/startrek/horta.htm
Apr 05 16:18:19 * SolBelter nods to Lensman
Apr 05 16:18:35 <Lensman> I still like "Devil" even if the alien was just a blanket thrown over an extra. The story worked.
Apr 05 16:18:43 <SolBelter> SURE EML!-
Apr 05 16:19:02 <Fred_of_Worlds> hey, it wasn't an extra. It was Jano Prohaska
Apr 05 16:19:02 <Lensman> Ed: You have our attention!
Apr 05 16:19:03 <rimworlder> yes, please segue. note: all of the ST original episodes are now up on paramounts website
Apr 05 16:19:04 * Hippy afk briefly to get acoffee. It's too early to function with out one
Apr 05 16:19:12 <Fred_of_Worlds> he built the thing. And played the Mugatu!
Apr 05 16:19:38 <Fred_of_Worlds> and now, "Aliens in Fred of Worlds"
Apr 05 16:19:39 <rimworlder> hippy, I'm with you - too late in the day to be without one
Apr 05 16:20:21 <EML> Okay. As most of you know, there's Fleet of Worlds (out now) and Juggler of Worlds (out in [recently rescheduled] September.
Apr 05 16:20:33 <rimworlder> breathless 'uhuh'
Apr 05 16:20:44 <Lensman> Yes...
Apr 05 16:20:47 <EML> Larry & I recently signed to do a third: Destroyer of Worlds.
Apr 05 16:20:55 <Lensman> HOORAY!
Apr 05 16:21:00 <rimworlder> "I am become death..."
Apr 05 16:21:01 <Fred_of_Worlds> yay!
Apr 05 16:21:05 <rimworlder> woohoo
Apr 05 16:21:10 <SolBelter> shiva ...
Apr 05 16:21:10 <Lensman> "Shiva..."
Apr 05 16:21:24 <Fred_of_Worlds> I'm thinking the bad guy from THOR myself
Apr 05 16:21:32 <jim_stiles> Yes, is this a reference to Shiva?
Apr 05 16:21:34 <Lensman> SB are you a "Destroyer" fan?
Apr 05 16:22:00 <EML> All three have Puppeters, of course. Juggler brings in Outsiders. Destroyer brings in the Pak.
Apr 05 16:22:08 <rimworlder> wow
Apr 05 16:22:09 <SolBelter> not the sinanju destroyer :)
Apr 05 16:22:22 <SolBelter> Pak! yay
Apr 05 16:22:42 <Fred_of_Worlds> I kept waiting for the aliens in FoW to turn out to be proto Outsiders
Apr 05 16:22:43 <Lensman> "Anticipation... anticipation is making me wait..."
Apr 05 16:23:08 <EML> As to Shiva ... I'm familiar with the quote and Teller's use of it.
Apr 05 16:23:10 <EML> As to any intersection with the plot, I'll admit only to liking the phrase.
Apr 05 16:23:16 <rimworlder> I think I'm suffering from most of the symptoms of arrested changeover...
Apr 05 16:23:17 <SolBelter> ( i was a science advisor to one of the Destroyer ghostwriters tho...)
Apr 05 16:23:41 <Lensman> Some of us thought the G'woth (sp?) were related to Jotaki, but Ed pointed out they're fundamentally different.
Apr 05 16:23:50 <EML> And also in Destroyer (back by popular demand), the Gw'oth.
Apr 05 16:24:11 <rimworlder> they're going to be building themselves right out of the atmosphere
Apr 05 16:24:25 <SolBelter> ...with their accelerated learning/research...
Apr 05 16:24:27 <Lensman> SB: That would be a "Yes" then. :)
Apr 05 16:24:34 <EML> rim: sorry, no plot points today.
Apr 05 16:24:51 <rimworlder> no, just speculation on my part
Apr 05 16:25:27 <rimworlder> or were you telling me to shut up?
Apr 05 16:25:28 <EML> And for those who weren't in the room that day ... the Gw'oth have no genetic relationship to the Jokoti.
Apr 05 16:25:30 <rimworlder> lol
Apr 05 16:25:31 * NickE (~NickE@172.209.180.33) has joined #knownspace
Apr 05 16:25:42 <NickE> meep
Apr 05 16:25:43 * Hippy has returned
Apr 05 16:25:52 <rimworlder> welcome and welcome back
Apr 05 16:25:52 <Hippy> Morning, NickE
Apr 05 16:25:57 <EML> Simple point: Jokoti adults walk about in air. Gw'oth are entirely aquatic.
Apr 05 16:26:03 * Lensman has changed the topic to: DESTROYER OF WORLDS
Apr 05 16:26:09 <NickE> wo totally forgot about the chat
Apr 05 16:26:15 <rimworlder> rimworlder sniffles
Apr 05 16:26:37 <NickE> hi all
Apr 05 16:26:40 <Fred_of_Worlds> http://fnord.fractalrain.com/gallery2/d/32391-3/1082520237_G.jpg
Apr 05 16:26:53 <Lensman> Well of course we're all dying to know if DOW will reveal whether or not the protectors are a result of genetic engineering, but of course we don't want you to tell us the answer!
Apr 05 16:26:59 <SolBelter> <== Lensman reminded me, or i'd have missed the chat too [thx, dave]
Apr 05 16:27:25 <NickE> ah so the 3rd book has a name. Shiny news Ed!
Apr 05 16:27:26 <EML> DoW is now the topic? Oh, the PRESSURE.
Apr 05 16:27:39 <Lensman> SB: I'm getting my handles mixed up. Are you Spike?
Apr 05 16:27:42 <rimworlder> lol - you can handle it
Apr 05 16:28:04 <EML> Nick: it has a name, a contract, and ... Pak.
Apr 05 16:28:10 <SolBelter> projectd DoW release date one yr from Sept?
Apr 05 16:28:19 <NickE> yes indeedy! Neat
Apr 05 16:28:27 <rimworlder> there goes my book budget
Apr 05 16:28:30 <NickE> heh
Apr 05 16:28:47 <NickE> least it'll go on teh good stuff
Apr 05 16:28:52 <EML> DoW release? too soon to tell. Personal guess: no sooner than 4Q09.
Apr 05 16:29:06 <Hippy> I haven't even read FLEET yet@ It's a sad state when authors can write quicker than I can read :(
Apr 05 16:29:06 <rimworlder> on the other hand, its two more reviews...
Apr 05 16:29:07 <NickE> 4009?
Apr 05 16:29:09 <Lensman> I don't think I can wait that long...
Apr 05 16:29:17 <SolBelter> y, Lens, i'm Spike MacPhee, KS Timeline fan, settling on my handle [i was belter last time]
Apr 05 16:29:18 <rimworlder> nick - definately
Apr 05 16:29:19 <NickE> long lead time
Apr 05 16:29:28 <EML> I won't tell you what you'll learn about the Pak, but you will learn more about them.
Apr 05 16:29:35 <Lensman> Oh sorry, that was 4th Quarter '09, not 4009
Apr 05 16:29:43 <NickE> phew
Apr 05 16:29:48 <EML> Nick: not a long lead time. We have to write it.
Apr 05 16:29:58 <NickE> well, OK then
Apr 05 16:30:01 <NickE> :-)
Apr 05 16:30:15 <SolBelter> thx EML -i'd like to use that quote with stress on *prjected, earliest*
Apr 05 16:30:21 <rimworlder> for a second there I thought you guys were trying to catch up to the KS timeline
Apr 05 16:30:48 <SolBelter> lol rworlder
Apr 05 16:31:08 <rimworlder> Ed - just out of curiosity, who are you working with at TOR, if I can ask?
Apr 05 16:31:25 <Hippy> Spike MacPhee...some kind of audio adventures? Buffy the Vampire Slayer or someting? Or am I going nuts?
Apr 05 16:31:39 <EML> even "projected earliest" is too official sounding. 4Q09 entirely a guess on my part. And I think early 2010 is quite possible.
Apr 05 16:32:15 <NickE> No *I'm Spike!* in BBtL audio dramaat least
Apr 05 16:32:16 <EML> Rim: my Tor editor (for Niven collaborations and Lerner solos) is Bob Gleason.
Apr 05 16:32:27 <SolBelter> hippy, that's my rl name, not a vid ref :) ran SF bookstore, HArvard sq 1977-89...
Apr 05 16:32:27 <rimworlder> 2010. I SHOULD be reading that book while visiting Clavius base
Apr 05 16:32:38 <NickE> Spike McPhee, longtime fan
Apr 05 16:32:55 <Hippy> Ah. Sorry, Nick
Apr 05 16:33:07 <rimworlder> Ed - just curiosity - I'm discovering that a lot of the folks at TOR are old fannish acquaintances of mine - many I worked with on worldcons back in the 70s
Apr 05 16:33:12 * Ronn has quit (Quit: *g0ne*)
Apr 05 16:33:19 * Hippy should have a better memory fcor credits than that
Apr 05 16:33:24 * Ronn (~Ronn@68.17.168.208) has joined #knownspace
Apr 05 16:33:31 <NickE> NP, folk adress me as Spike in relation to my audio drama role
Apr 05 16:33:32 <SolBelter> ronn: gonn ...
Apr 05 16:33:37 <NickE> Hi Ronn
Apr 05 16:33:43 <Lensman> Hey Ronn, come when you can stay awhile! :)
Apr 05 16:33:44 <rimworlder> hi ronn
Apr 05 16:34:07 <NickE> (online anyway)
Apr 05 16:34:08 <Hippy> Welcome back, Ronn
Apr 05 16:34:14 <rimworlder> and I think Gleason was the treasurer for SunCon in '77
Apr 05 16:34:47 <EML> I'm a con noobie. First one wasn't until 2000.
Apr 05 16:34:47 <Lensman> SB did you see the private message I sent you?
Apr 05 16:34:51 * SeanS (~not@204.118.65.96) has joined #knownspace
Apr 05 16:34:51 * SeanS gives channel operator status to SeanS
Apr 05 16:34:51 * SeanS sets mode +O #knownspace SeanS
Apr 05 16:35:15 <SolBelter> ok EML, "perhaps early 2010, EML ventured" ??
Apr 05 16:35:44 <Lensman> Ed: So do I understand you have the title and a contract, but you haven't yet worked out even the basic plot of DOW yet?
Apr 05 16:35:45 <SeanS> hello again to everyone. errands completed
Apr 05 16:35:53 <EML> SB: okay, that's suitably tentative :-)
Apr 05 16:36:21 <rimworlder> suitably tentative = irrationally exhuberant
Apr 05 16:36:23 <SolBelter> [i'm SPNN, Spindrift, the SciLands, Second Life, reporter]
Apr 05 16:36:43 <SolBelter> excellent eml! thank you.
Apr 05 16:36:55 <Ronn> Okay, that wasn't intentional. Tried to do something & got disconnected . . .
Apr 05 16:37:06 <EML> Lens: we're farther along than that. we have a plot, very detailed background notes about various alien species, and a prologue.
Apr 05 16:37:23 <Hippy> What day does April 30th fall on this year?
Apr 05 16:37:38 <SeanS> wednesday
Apr 05 16:37:39 <jim_stiles> Wed
Apr 05 16:37:50 <EML> Wodins Day.
Apr 05 16:38:08 <Lensman> Ed: Okay, I was just trying to parse your "it has a name, a contract, and ... Pak." comment.
Apr 05 16:38:10 <Hippy> Ah... Well, it struck me that that is LN's threescore years and ten, so who would be into a chat on the 30th?
Apr 05 16:38:16 <Hippy> A birthday one
Apr 05 16:38:26 <SolBelter> http://spindriftisland.wordpress.com/ is my venue but the sf news goes in my personal blog http://paradoxolbers.wordpress.com/
Apr 05 16:38:39 <Lensman> SolBelter: Yes, I'm trying to send you a private message but you're not responding.
Apr 05 16:39:17 <SolBelter> k lens - i'm not faMiliar with the interface - will ck
Apr 05 16:39:18 <rimworlder> Ed - will there be room for a fourth, or are time frames getting crunched?
Apr 05 16:39:38 <rimworlder> KS timeframes
Apr 05 16:40:01 <Lensman> SolBelter: No, I used the /msg mode, it should have shown up in your regular window. I guess IRC commands don't work with your interface.
Apr 05 16:40:29 <EML> A fourth is possible, which isn't to say there's been any discussion of one.
Apr 05 16:40:47 <Fred_of_Worlds> ack, larry's birthday is upon us?
Apr 05 16:40:48 <Lensman> SolBelter: I'll send you an e-mail
Apr 05 16:40:48 <rimworlder> thanks ed.
Apr 05 16:40:55 <SolBelter> worked fine Lens- replied [distracted by multiple browsers info, too :)
Apr 05 16:41:07 <Fred_of_Worlds> and I haven't even started shopping
Apr 05 16:41:19 <NickE> fred, not good! I mean good, but oh crap how short is time Tanj wise!
Apr 05 16:41:26 <Fred_of_Worlds> yeah
Apr 05 16:41:33 <SolBelter> easy! get Larry boosterspice...
Apr 05 16:41:41 <Fred_of_Worlds> I thought it was more towards the end of the year
Apr 05 16:41:43 <EML> or a yam.
Apr 05 16:41:46 <NickE> me too
Apr 05 16:41:47 <rimworlder> lol
Apr 05 16:41:58 <Hippy> He can have one of my many discarded corneas :)
Apr 05 16:42:00 <rimworlder> I eat tons of yams and NOTHING yet
Apr 05 16:42:06 <NickE> heh
Apr 05 16:42:24 <SolBelter> but seeriously, in our timeline writing, back when, there was a clear ref in Grendel
Apr 05 16:42:29 <rimworlder> except that pesky arthritis and weakening heart
Apr 05 16:42:33 <Hippy> You should eat more thallium oxide, Sol
Apr 05 16:42:41 <EML> Now Popeye says "I yam what I yam," but yet it's spinach that works for him.
Apr 05 16:42:49 <SolBelter> to when " acertain Junx biolab synthesized boosterspice
Apr 05 16:42:54 <NickE> not really, toxic as hell
Apr 05 16:43:00 <NickE> Thallium
Apr 05 16:43:07 <SolBelter> there is a novel or shared=univ anthols
Apr 05 16:43:26 <SolBelter> waiting to be written about the impact f that
Apr 05 16:43:28 <rimworlder> my mind has been expanding tho...
Apr 05 16:43:29 <NickE> One of Saddams fv poisons for rivals/opponents apparently
Apr 05 16:43:47 <SolBelter> [Crashlander p 121]
Apr 05 16:43:51 <Ronn> "Junx biolab" works with junk DNA?
Apr 05 16:43:51 <rimworlder> yes, and used elsewhere as a poison as well
Apr 05 16:44:06 <Lensman> Spike provided some "fan history" documents which are of interest to long-time Niven fans.
Apr 05 16:44:11 <Lensman> http://www.freewebs.com/knownspace/galleryDocs.htm
Apr 05 16:44:30 <Lensman> Oops, I should have said "SolBelter provided..."
Apr 05 16:44:40 <rimworlder> I'm dying to know if those new books are going to kill my theory
Apr 05 16:45:01 <EML> Umm, what theory?
Apr 05 16:45:07 <rimworlder> (first the worm goes on the hook, THEN we throw it in the water...)
Apr 05 16:45:10 <rimworlder> LOL
Apr 05 16:45:18 <Lensman> LOL! Yah, we're all dying to know if DOW will kill various theories about the Pak and tree-of-life virus.
Apr 05 16:45:19 <rimworlder> that the puppeteers are really the tunuctipun
Apr 05 16:45:24 <SolBelter> Jerry Boyajian and i wrote the timeline and gave it to larry for rewtie for use
Apr 05 16:45:31 <Ronn> You could always call a fourth one "Worlds Without Number" . . .
Apr 05 16:45:33 <SolBelter> in tales of known space
Apr 05 16:46:01 <EML> too bad Worlds of Warcraft is taken ;-)
Apr 05 16:46:05 <Lensman> Rimworlder has a new Known Space fan theory posted at my website here:
Apr 05 16:46:11 <Lensman> http://www.freewebs.com/knownspace/alt.htm
Apr 05 16:46:21 <Hippy> Ah, yes. 'Dates in 'The Ethicsof Madness; must be considered erroneous'
Apr 05 16:46:22 <SeanS> so while i was running errands it became known that there is going to be a third in the 'worlds' books?
Apr 05 16:46:35 <rimworlder> sean yes
Apr 05 16:46:42 <EML> Sean: yup. Destroyer of Worlds.
Apr 05 16:46:46 <Lensman> Sean: Yah that's why I changed the subject line.
Apr 05 16:46:51 <SeanS> i was wondering at the topic
Apr 05 16:47:03 <SeanS> excellent.
Apr 05 16:47:07 <NickE> brb
Apr 05 16:47:13 <EML> the topic is a reference to my brown thumb.
Apr 05 16:47:19 <SeanS> heh
Apr 05 16:47:20 <rimworlder> to be followed by Rebuilder of Worlds and Interior Decorating of Worlds in short order
Apr 05 16:48:18 <EML> See how cleverly I diverted y'all from quaetions about Juggler of Worlds?
Apr 05 16:48:20 <rimworlder> There's just so much space! I don't know what I'm going to do with this room
Apr 05 16:48:21 <Lensman> LOL! What was the name of the worldbuilders in HHGTTG?
Apr 05 16:48:34 <SeanS> magratheans
Apr 05 16:48:39 <Hippy> What about Ministry of Planning of Wordsl?
Apr 05 16:48:43 <FlyingAway> Hello
Apr 05 16:48:46 <rimworlder> hi
Apr 05 16:48:49 <SeanS> hi carol
Apr 05 16:48:50 <EML> ola
Apr 05 16:48:50 <Hippy> You have to get permisssion to rebuild
Apr 05 16:48:53 <Lensman> "The Martha Stewart of the Magratheans"
Apr 05 16:48:57 <rimworlder> Taxation of Worlds...
Apr 05 16:49:02 * FlyingAway is now known as FlyingDragon
Apr 05 16:49:05 <EML> Repo of Worlds
Apr 05 16:49:12 <rimworlder> Zoning Boards of Worlds
Apr 05 16:49:25 <NickE> heh
Apr 05 16:49:32 <FlyingDragon> Fred of Worlds. LOL
Apr 05 16:49:34 <rimworlder> "nope, sorry. you can't get a variance for a mixed industrial/agricultural use...
Apr 05 16:49:54 <rimworlder> and so the puppeteers moved on
Apr 05 16:50:07 <jim_stiles> Beyond the Valley of the Worlds
Apr 05 16:50:10 <rimworlder> lol
Apr 05 16:50:16 <Hippy> You've achieved tru fame, Ed, when people are willing to send you up :)
Apr 05 16:50:21 <EML> or the puppeteers died out of dance fever.
Apr 05 16:50:25 <Lensman> Well if we can't get zoning approval, we'll just build down... like the Krell.
Apr 05 16:50:38 <SolBelter> is it fairer to say, EML, that DoW is set against the same backdrop events of 1st 2, or say third in the sries?
Apr 05 16:50:54 <rimworlder> oh no, seriousness!
Apr 05 16:51:11 <Ronn> So dance fever .NE. "Staying Alive"?
Apr 05 16:51:32 <rimworlder> duet for three legs?
Apr 05 16:51:43 <EML> SB: DOW will take place after FOW and JOW. That said, it'll be standalone.
Apr 05 16:51:52 <SolBelter> trio for 3 legs?
Apr 05 16:52:05 <jim_stiles> Ronn, no FORTRAN jokes
Apr 05 16:52:07 <SolBelter> thx again!
Apr 05 16:52:11 <rimworlder> I'm picturing a cantina scene with niven aliens...
Apr 05 16:52:19 <Lensman> As long as your dance fever doesn't come from the demon in Buffy: "Once More, With Feeling".
Apr 05 16:52:28 <rimworlder> lol
Apr 05 16:52:30 <EML> brb
Apr 05 16:52:55 <Hippy> They could do the 'No Moon Walk'
Apr 05 16:53:02 <rimworlder> rofl
Apr 05 16:53:11 <Lensman> Rim: There's a scene like that in the /Draco Tavern/ collection.
Apr 05 16:53:17 <SolBelter> tirle generator diff first lettr, then figger out the word - Foe, Jow, Dow, Sow, Cow< gow...
Apr 05 16:53:19 <Lensman> A fannish play.
Apr 05 16:53:21 <rimworlder> yeah, vaguely remember it
Apr 05 16:53:28 <SolBelter> title gen^
Apr 05 16:53:33 <Hippy> 'Billie Jean is not my lover, she is a separate species that have been symbiotic with us for all history'
Apr 05 16:53:43 <NickE> lol
Apr 05 16:54:09 <rimworlder> hippy - ain't that the truth
Apr 05 16:54:22 <Hippy> LOL!!
Apr 05 16:54:22 <rimworlder> and I wouldn't call it symbiotic - its parasitic
Apr 05 16:54:25 <Lensman> Oh Kdapt, mixing country-western with Niven! The horror, the horror...
Apr 05 16:54:42 <rimworlder> lol - now I know why I come in here
Apr 05 16:55:49 <Hippy> A Niven C&W song? Hmm... But I tinkk it would test the finest filker in the world to do that
Apr 05 16:56:00 <Fred_of_Worlds> Oh my Teela
Apr 05 16:56:04 <Fred_of_Worlds> Oh my Teela
Apr 05 16:56:14 <Fred_of_Worlds> Oh my Teeeela jandrova Brown
Apr 05 16:56:19 <Fred_of_Worlds> She is lost and gone forever
Apr 05 16:56:33 <Fred_of_Worlds> My Teeellaaaa Jandrova Brown
Apr 05 16:56:52 <Hippy> Or maybe not
Apr 05 16:56:56 <rimworlder> lol
Apr 05 16:56:59 <NickE> heh
Apr 05 16:57:12 <EML> <groan>
Apr 05 16:57:19 <Hippy> Fred: second verse, ssame as the first?
Apr 05 16:57:24 <Fred_of_Worlds> hee hee
Apr 05 16:57:34 <Fred_of_Worlds> There waaaaaaaaaaaas
Apr 05 16:57:39 <Fred_of_Worlds> Flup on the saddle
Apr 05 16:57:42 <Ronn> Don't quit your day job, F_o_W . . .
Apr 05 16:57:44 <Fred_of_Worlds> and Flup on the ground
Apr 05 16:57:51 <Fred_of_Worlds> and great big puddle, of
Apr 05 16:57:57 <Fred_of_Worlds> Flup on the ground
Apr 05 16:58:02 * aldo (~aldo@68.225.240.96) has joined #knownspace
Apr 05 16:58:16 <EML> I think that'll be a flup-side track.
Apr 05 16:58:29 <Hippy> Howdy, ADldo
Apr 05 16:58:31 <NickE> groan
Apr 05 16:58:42 <FlyingDragon> Aldo! YOu made it!
Apr 05 16:58:44 * Lensman has changed the topic to: LARRY NIVEN'S FREEFALL
Apr 05 16:58:51 <aldo> Hello everyone
Apr 05 16:58:54 <Hippy> What about a song about a henpecked Kzin? His kzinrett only knows four words, but she will not shut up
Apr 05 16:58:56 <NickE> hi
Apr 05 16:59:04 <Fred_of_Worlds> did Ed have stuff he actually wanted to ask us about aliens?
Apr 05 16:59:08 <Fred_of_Worlds> and we're being rude?
Apr 05 16:59:17 <FlyingDragon> You can henpeck with no words!!!!
Apr 05 16:59:19 <Lensman> Welcome, Aldo! Please save us from bad Niven Country-Western lyrics. (The "bad" is of course redundant...)
Apr 05 16:59:22 <Fred_of_Worlds> not that I'm adverse to being rude, just asking
Apr 05 16:59:25 <Ronn> 'allo aldo (someone had to say it)
Apr 05 16:59:26 <rimworlder> hippy - only problem with that is that in Kzin society, "you can live with em, and you can kill em"
Apr 05 16:59:36 <FlyingDragon> Been liking the C&W Niven!!!!!!
Apr 05 16:59:42 <aldo> Okay, you're all saved!
Apr 05 16:59:52 <EML> FOW: no questions in mind, just wanted to share the news.
Apr 05 16:59:54 <Fred_of_Worlds> you can tell who's a texas gal
Apr 05 17:00:00 <Fred_of_Worlds> oh, okay, cool Ed
Apr 05 17:00:12 <Fred_of_Worlds> was afraid we'd stepped on something important to you :)
Apr 05 17:00:24 <rimworlder> oh darn, Ed. we wanted to contribute
Apr 05 17:00:37 <EML> Now if there's anything people are dying to know about Pak or Gw'oth, I'm happy to listen ...
Apr 05 17:00:42 <Hippy> Good observationn, Rim
Apr 05 17:00:46 <rimworlder> LOL
Apr 05 17:00:52 <Lensman> Aldo, since I guess you'll only be here for a short time, let me jump in and ask: Just what are you doing for the "Freefall" project?
Apr 05 17:01:17 <EML> and for the really uninitated, what IS the freefall project?
Apr 05 17:01:22 <rimworlder> what is the freefall project
Apr 05 17:01:26 <rimworlder> LOL
Apr 05 17:01:53 <aldo> I'm essentially the chief engineer. I'm designing the spacecraft and much of the technology. Even dolphin spacesuits?
Apr 05 17:02:13 <Lensman> Info on FREEFALL:
Apr 05 17:02:16 <Lensman> http://kotaku.com/362450/larry-niven-teams-with-alchemic-for-free-fall
Apr 05 17:02:28 <Lensman> WOW totally kewl!
Apr 05 17:02:30 <aldo> Free Fall is planned to be arry's first major entry into the world of videogames
Apr 05 17:02:41 <NickE> looks good
Apr 05 17:02:43 <aldo> that's LARRY
Apr 05 17:03:01 <Lensman> Yes, we read typo. :)
Apr 05 17:03:15 <NickE> Good cos i tyop typo
Apr 05 17:03:22 <Hippy> And what of the Ringworld games???
Apr 05 17:03:30 <EML> and Halo?
Apr 05 17:03:38 <Lensman> When Larry mentioned it, he wasn't sure this project would be carried thru to completion. Do you think it will be?
Apr 05 17:03:39 <SolBelter> Aldo, can we try in Sedcond Life to make a copy [credited to u] of yr Orion ship/Footfall] - i saw the plans recently... good work!
Apr 05 17:03:40 <aldo> Thanks. got a sticky keyboard and can't type worth a damn anyhow!
Apr 05 17:04:29 <rimworlder> very very cool
Apr 05 17:05:09 <aldo> The key to selling this project is Alchemic Productions, operated by Brian Gomez and Rick Ernst. They are working hard to sell the project using their considerable experience and connections
Apr 05 17:06:07 <Lensman> So, Alchemic is the designer and they're looking for a publisher?
Apr 05 17:06:30 <aldo> I'm open to putting battleship Michael in SL. sounds cool! Contact me offline.
Apr 05 17:07:01 <rimworlder> well, I've got a schizo-hyper yorkie on my hands right now and he insists that I want to play with him more than I want to chat...so I gotta go. Ed - thanks for the kind words. Lens - thanks for the space for the article, Hippy - good luck with everything. Aldo - cool stuff! The rest of you - see you later.
Apr 05 17:07:21 * rimworlder has quit (Quit: *g0ne*)
Apr 05 17:07:31 <aldo> Larry, myself, Brian, Rick are designing the game together, but Rick & Brian have the real gaming expertise
Apr 05 17:07:51 <SolBelter> k! Aldo i'm paradox.olbers@gmail.com in SL - ow to ping u?
Apr 05 17:08:16 <aldo> contact me at aldo@alum.mit.edu
Apr 05 17:09:27 <SolBelter> roger that Aldo! :)
Apr 05 17:09:53 * Hippy thanks whomever for the axial tilt of the Earth. The sun is just coming up but is not searing his head off
Apr 05 17:09:59 <EML> Good luck with the game, Aldo.
Apr 05 17:10:36 <EML> No, hippy, axes cut things, not sear hem.
Apr 05 17:10:50 <SeanS> in just less than 12 hours, I depart for florida... praying for lots of sun for the next week
Apr 05 17:10:56 <aldo> Thanks! We'll keep you guys in the loop as the game project progresses
Apr 05 17:11:19 <Lensman> Aldo: If you don't mind my asking, how much time do you spend doing spacecraft designs? Is Aerospace Imagineering your primary job, or is it a sideline?
Apr 05 17:11:23 <Hippy> Well observed, Ed. In that ase, I thank whomever is directing this weird 'TRuman Show' I'm stuck in
Apr 05 17:12:15 <aldo> No, I work full time at Northrop Grumman. Though, my job is to envision future technology, so I'm involved in this stuff 24/7
Apr 05 17:12:35 <FlyingDragon> List up! COool!
Apr 05 17:12:35 <Ronn> Hippy: that would be whatever lunatic is responsible for the moon . . .
Apr 05 17:13:06 <FlyingDragon> NE of you Alfred K?
Apr 05 17:13:14 <Hippy> Ah, the moon. That was inconstantly vright last night...
Apr 05 17:13:33 <Ronn> SeanS: you hope it's better than what we've been having here
Apr 05 17:13:48 <aldo> Aerospace Imagineering is strictly my sideline. I'm CEO and janitor if you know what I mean
Apr 05 17:13:51 <Lensman> Aldo: How did you first start collaborating with Larry? Did you approach him about the Niven Project, or what?
Apr 05 17:15:07 <aldo> I approached Larry at a L.A. con sometime around 1995 and showed him my concepts for Lying Bastard. He invited me to his house and we've been friends, working together on and off ever since.
Apr 05 17:15:21 <NickE> shiny
Apr 05 17:15:49 <SeanS> Ronn: it is storming like hell in destin right now but supposed to be mid to upper 70's and sunny all week... unless they change the forcast yet again
Apr 05 17:16:31 <SolBelter> [stunned few days ago remembering i met aldo at Lunacon when he was a teenageror early 20s...]
Apr 05 17:16:54 <Hippy> Not a cloud in the sky and they're tipping 72 F or thereabouts. Unusually warmm for April, too
Apr 05 17:17:07 <SolBelter> one of aldo's first artshows attended
Apr 05 17:17:17 <aldo> SolBelter is that right!?! Cool! I really loved those lunacons!
Apr 05 17:17:27 <SeanS> so if the server goes down sometime this week, I will fix it when I get back
Apr 05 17:17:30 <EML> aldo: what part of NG? I used to work there, and still occasionally consult for them.
Apr 05 17:17:30 <SolBelter> i loved the lying bastard - accurate!
Apr 05 17:18:05 <FlyingDragon> It is ALBOLUTELY perfect weather here in Houston!!!!
Apr 05 17:18:25 <aldo> Thanks! One of these days I plan to give Lying Bastard the full 3D treatment. Certainly one of the great spacecraft concepts of all time!
Apr 05 17:19:12 <Lensman> Aldo, thanks muchly for the 3-view of the /Liar/! That looks like it should be a poster on my wall. How many of the details on that did Larry contribute?
Apr 05 17:19:31 <SolBelter> i saw larry's sketches for ringworld at NYCon-six of them yr LBast is exactly the same
Apr 05 17:19:54 <SolBelter> those sketches were sold at the auction-never seen again...
Apr 05 17:20:11 <aldo> I pretty much came up with everything. I work the concepts on my own based on reading Larry's stories and submit them to him for comment
Apr 05 17:21:27 <aldo> Larry provides just the right amount of written description. He provides the framework and a designer has the fun of filling in the details!
Apr 05 17:21:34 <SolBelter> Michael Gilbert famously said of trying to illustrate Larry, "he'll tell u an alien has a hand, but not if he has an elbow!"
Apr 05 17:21:57 <Fred_of_Worlds> he'll tell you if a root has an elbow
Apr 05 17:21:59 * SolBelter nods to aldo re level of descr by LN
Apr 05 17:22:02 <NickE> heh
Apr 05 17:22:11 <EML> it's a disjointed writing style
Apr 05 17:22:24 <SolBelter> aaaaahhh! lol
Apr 05 17:22:25 <Fred_of_Worlds> disjointed elbows are very painful
Apr 05 17:22:49 <FlyingDragon> Larry says all his characters are naken unless he describes clothes!
Apr 05 17:22:54 <FlyingDragon> NAKED
Apr 05 17:23:27 <Ronn> That's OK Carol: no one can see you on-line . . .
Apr 05 17:23:52 <Hippy> More 's the pity
Apr 05 17:23:52 <NickE> aw
Apr 05 17:24:06 <FlyingDragon> I"m wearing black from my martial arts class. WHat city did you say you were in????
Apr 05 17:24:36 <NickE> tease :-)
Apr 05 17:25:06 <Lensman> SB: Yah, trying to select the *right* illustrations for the Incompleat Known Space Concordance is a challenge. My request to use illos from /The Guide to Larry Niven's Ringworld/ got routed to Larry, who said I should be very particular about using stuff from that book. I assured him I planned on being quite selective in my use!
Apr 05 17:25:25 <SolBelter> here's my Ringworld gallery in SL http://www.flickr.com/photos/22159806@N07/2192869115/in/set-72157603716846589/
Apr 05 17:26:03 <EML> So: anyone have any comments or questions about Pak? No promises it'll influence Destroyer, but just trolling for your thoughts. ...
Apr 05 17:26:06 <SolBelter> i'm slowly gathering all the KS art i can from ppl to show there...
Apr 05 17:26:15 <EML> In another few minutes I'm going to be on my way.
Apr 05 17:26:17 <aldo> Yeah that Guide was vey uneven in its depiction of Niven tech
Apr 05 17:26:28 <jim_stiles> Bye - sorry, gotta to back to bed - I hope someone is keeping a log. - Say hi to Larry, if he shows.
Apr 05 17:26:38 * jim_stiles has quit (Quit: *g0ne*)
Apr 05 17:26:50 <SolBelter> Pak - relentless, not negotiators, scary for that reason
Apr 05 17:27:01 <Hippy> Actually, Ed, who do think was smarter? Louis Wu as a Protector, or the Ghoul one whose name I've forgotte?
Apr 05 17:27:15 <FlyingDragon> Does Larry say that there are NO sexual differences in Pak after the transformation? Females transform and think jus the same as males?
Apr 05 17:27:50 <EML> Hiipy: while I have an opinion (Louis), humans and ghouls are far removed from Pak.
Apr 05 17:28:58 <NickE> So just what is the basis for the pak sense of smell?
Apr 05 17:29:07 <Hippy> Good point, Ed. But I agree with you that lOUIS WAS THE MORE CLUEY ONE
Apr 05 17:29:13 <EML> While Protector says sex organs vanish, there's no definitive statement that behaviors are (or aren't) the same thereafter.
Apr 05 17:29:34 <Lensman> Ed: Well, the protectors appear to be so unlikely to result as a random mutation of a virus, that several/ many fans and/or writers have suggested tree-of-life virus is the result of genetic engineering. Of course, Tnuctipun being the master genegineers, they're the obvious suspects. But it's hard for me to believe the Pak have had protectors for 1.5 billion years. Any species that warlike should have wiped themselves out long ago, or else expanded
Apr 05 17:29:36 <NickE> like how family/mutant specific
Apr 05 17:29:43 <EML> The protector stage may retain some learned behaviors.
Apr 05 17:30:06 <Lensman> Ed: So I'm hoping you and Larry will come up with a scenario which better explains that.
Apr 05 17:30:39 <EML> I got some good notes about tree-of-life last month's chat (and now you know why I cared).
Apr 05 17:30:45 <Hippy> i WOULD THINK A PROTECTOR WOULD REMEMBER EVERY BIT OF BEHAVIOUR IT EVER LEARNT, AND IF THAT INLUDED FEMININE MANNERISMS THEN IT WOULD HAVE TEM
Apr 05 17:30:58 <Hippy> Did I just hit the Caps Lock?
Apr 05 17:31:11 <FlyingDragon> Yes, Hippy, and you were SCREAMING at us.
Apr 05 17:31:12 <aldo> Hi Ed, sorry I missed your earlier question. I'm with NG Integrated Systems in El Segundo, CA
Apr 05 17:31:14 * Hippy apologises for bad manners
Apr 05 17:31:41 <EML> to remember a bahavior doesn't obligate one to keep following it. even we flawed breeders can sometimes outgrow misguided behaviors ;-)
Apr 05 17:32:06 <Lensman> Who was it who pointed out that Brennan-monster got TOL to grow in a yam, suggesting that the ancestor of the yam was actually TOL root?
Apr 05 17:32:16 <FlyingDragon> I would think that females would STILL have a better corpus colossum!
Apr 05 17:32:31 <EML> Aldo: I was with some IT function (forget what it's called now) in Reston, VA (outside DC).
Apr 05 17:32:46 <SeanS> Just ordered papajohns online... talk about excellent uses of the internet.
Apr 05 17:33:03 <Hippy> You could get into some interesting questions about how makes andfemales behave differntly. What the differences actually are
Apr 05 17:33:19 <EML> yam pizza would be apt.
Apr 05 17:33:32 <SeanS> it would but i went with 'the works'
Apr 05 17:33:34 <aldo> Cool! I believe the Reston facility is now part of Mission Systems. By the way, recently read Fleet of Worlds and LOVED it!
Apr 05 17:33:46 <NickE> was ace
Apr 05 17:34:44 <EML> thanks, Aldo. There are several NG facilities in Reston. I don't think mine went into Mission systems. you may be thinking of the former TASC and/or TRW.
Apr 05 17:34:54 <Ronn> I have canned yams in the kitchen
Apr 05 17:34:55 * Hippy is going to have to restart mIRC because the damn TTS agent has shut down. Nobody talk till I get back :)
Apr 05 17:35:05 * Hippy has quit ()
Apr 05 17:35:18 <SeanS> heh, i am logging it at the house
Apr 05 17:35:25 <Ronn> mmmmphh!
Apr 05 17:35:27 <FlyingDragon> EML, my 12 yo son would like to know what your middle initial is.
Apr 05 17:35:32 <Lensman> Aldo, do you have any idea how many months it will be until you know whether or not FREEFALL will get the green light?
Apr 05 17:35:37 * SeanS points up to the SeanLog user
Apr 05 17:35:43 <aldo> Yes, I think you're right. NG is now a vast far flung empire
Apr 05 17:36:07 <EML> Dragon: M = Mark.
Apr 05 17:36:56 <aldo> That's a good question regarding a free fall go-ahead. I'm guessing we'll have a pretty good idea if it will sell before this fall
Apr 05 17:37:13 <FlyingDragon> TY. I'm going to have to leave soon, as son and I are in the middle of watching SW chapter 3. He won't wait forever for me to play on the computer.
Apr 05 17:37:34 <FlyingDragon> My son sez "That is correct."
Apr 05 17:37:48 <EML> Glad he approves of my middle name ;-)
Apr 05 17:38:19 <Ronn> What if he hadn't?
Apr 05 17:38:44 <EML> I'm cutting out, too (or Pak-in' it in, as it were). Good talkin' to everyone.
Apr 05 17:38:59 <SeanS> thanks for dropping by Ed
Apr 05 17:39:07 <NickE> Cheers Ed
Apr 05 17:39:10 * Hippy (~captlychee@122.104.111.185) has joined #knownspace
Apr 05 17:39:18 <Lensman> Oof! Thanks for coming, Ed. I'm glad you've made it a habit!
Apr 05 17:39:21 * rimworlder (~rimworlder@24.61.225.107) has joined #knownspace
Apr 05 17:39:22 <aldo> Take care, Ed!
Apr 05 17:39:24 <FlyingDragon> CU EML!
Apr 05 17:39:26 <SeanS> wb hippy
Apr 05 17:39:34 <SeanS> wb rim
Apr 05 17:39:37 <EML> TTFN.
Apr 05 17:39:39 * EML has quit (Quit: *g0ne*)
Apr 05 17:39:45 <Hippy> 'Bye, Ed
Apr 05 17:39:45 <rimworlder> thanks
Apr 05 17:39:52 <rimworlder> the yorkie is now taking a nap
Apr 05 17:40:32 <SeanS> nick, check private
Apr 05 17:40:36 <rimworlder> anyone know when the log of the chat goes up?
Apr 05 17:40:58 <SeanS> hmm, i wont be home until the weekend so it will take me till at least then
Apr 05 17:41:01 <SolBelter> rim, sean sends them in...
Apr 05 17:41:20 <rimworlder> ahh - but where is sean that it isn't the weekend?
Apr 05 17:41:20 <SeanS> if anyone else is logging, they can email them to mark firestone the larryniven.org webmaster
Apr 05 17:41:21 <SolBelter> but last one or 2 still not up, so it varies :)
Apr 05 17:41:27 <Lensman> Aldo: Is there anything else you'd like to tell us about "Freefall"? This is strictly a gamebox release, is that right? If it sells well, is it reasonable to think there will be a PC version? I'd like to own the game, but the only way I could play it is by using a friend's game machine.
Apr 05 17:41:32 <SeanS> i get behind from time to time
Apr 05 17:42:09 * Hippy will be aFK performing his morning ablutions for a while. I'm logging so I shall be lurking here, ready to read the chat when I get back
Apr 05 17:42:23 <rimworlder> have fun
Apr 05 17:42:34 <Hippy> So if I don't respond, it's because I'm not here. And this TTS agent is not working properly, dammit!
Apr 05 17:42:44 * Hippy AFK
Apr 05 17:42:47 <aldo> I think FREEFALL will initially be targeted for PS3/XBOX but I think it will be availabl for PC if successful
Apr 05 17:43:01 <SeanS> the applet works pretty good but i dont think it has a logging feature
Apr 05 17:44:17 <rimworlder> also - can you paint your suit?
Apr 05 17:44:27 <SeanS> when i get back, i will look into some TTS soft for ya hippy
Apr 05 17:44:47 <aldo> Just between us boys and girls, FREEFALL is essentially KNOWN SPACE. However, if we call it Known Space, there are daunting legal complications. So for now at least, it's a new universe.
Apr 05 17:45:19 <Lensman> Sean: Is there a way to log in mIRC? I see I can open a log file, but I don't see a way to record a log.
Apr 05 17:45:29 <SeanS> yeah
Apr 05 17:45:45 <SeanS> in the logging menu, you can tell it to log channels and privates
Apr 05 17:45:57 <aldo> You'll at least be able to choose your suit art, and possibly paint. Dolphins will be major characters in the game and they'll have suit art too
Apr 05 17:46:06 <SeanS> i used to use mirc to log all of them but linux and xchat are much more stable
Apr 05 17:46:17 <SolBelter> i still have my rick sternback star trek map with kzin space on it... :) from the Slaver weapon animated trek
Apr 05 17:46:38 <Lensman> Aldo: Oh? How hush-hush is that info? I put up a news item at the LarryNiven.org site, and I'd like to expand that.
Apr 05 17:46:39 <SolBelter> suit art! high-five!
Apr 05 17:47:02 <rimworlder> sean - very cool. I worked on a Ringworld adventure (RPG) years ago that involved a team of dolphins sent there to explore the underwater portion of the map of mars
Apr 05 17:47:31 <SolBelter> wow-good scenario, rimworlder!
Apr 05 17:47:46 <rimworlder> yeah - but no one gets to use the dali painting
Apr 05 17:48:08 <rimworlder> it was slated to be an adventure pack but they folded the game instead
Apr 05 17:48:45 <aldo> This is for chat eye's only. PLEASE DON't mention that FREEFALL might be related to KNOWN SPACE! The lawyers would be drooling! When it is released, you''' all be able to judge for yourselves.
Apr 05 17:48:46 <rimworlder> SB - yeah, we figured we'd get the adventures into the control center through an underwater port.
Apr 05 17:49:24 <rimworlder> aldo - no prob - but I wouldn't worry too much. there's plenty of gaming examples of re-named properties
Apr 05 17:49:31 <SeanS> ok, i will excise the comment from the log before posting it
Apr 05 17:49:40 * SolBelter grins to rimworlder
Apr 05 17:49:54 <rimworlder> I'm grinning back
Apr 05 17:50:27 <SolBelter> it'd not aldo's worry, but the *lawyers* worry, so supercautious
Apr 05 17:50:35 <rimworlder> we had a lot of fun predicting the evolution of sea-based mammals
Apr 05 17:50:52 <Lensman> That sounds very, very kewl. So we can upload a graphic image to use as suit art! Maybe a Michael Whelan, from the Barsoom books... or something closer to home. Stephan Martiniere's painting for /Ringworld's Children/ is literally stunning, but I'm not sure it would work for suit art. Maybe Whelan's /Smoke Ring/ cover.
Apr 05 17:51:04 <rimworlder> no doubt they can make trouble, but if people wanted to fight such a thing, they wouldn't win.
Apr 05 17:51:25 <Lensman> Aldo: Okay, mum's the word.
Apr 05 17:51:40 <rimworlder> I'm gonna go for the nude woman on the front AND the back...
Apr 05 17:51:53 <SolBelter> it's the threat of prolonged legal action burning much money, rimw
Apr 05 17:52:12 <SeanS> hopefully the suit art will be able to be very detailed. belters suits come to mind
Apr 05 17:52:26 <aldo> Yes, you're absolutely right. The Known Space issues can probably be resolved if we decide that's an advantage to game marketing and sales. It's just that resolving these issues would take waaaay longer than we care to wait. We'll sell the game first and see what happens.
Apr 05 17:52:34 <Lensman> Right, the way to win a lawsuit is not to get involved in one.
Apr 05 17:52:35 <rimworlder> SB - that's what I meant by causing trouble. these are things I'm familiar with. if you think book/game rights legal issues are fun, try dealing with paintball patent issues
Apr 05 17:53:29 <SolBelter> 'my patent is for all round ammo!" gimme da royalties!
Apr 05 17:53:43 <rimworlder> and I wasn't suggesting fight it just to do so; the courtroom is a crapshoot. anything can and does happen, including judge's ignoring or overturning long-standing law
Apr 05 17:53:53 <rimworlder> SB - just about
Apr 05 17:54:10 <SolBelter> "my paintball patent is for all velocity-increasing weapons"!!
Apr 05 17:54:22 <FlyingDragon> Gotta run now. I've a date with my son.
Apr 05 17:54:25 <Lensman> Aldo: So if FREEFALL has artificial gravity, then in relation to Known Space it has to be at the time of the Second Man-Kzin War or later. I'm guessing reactionless thrusters aren't in the game, 'cuz Larry said it was all real science except for the artificial gravity?
Apr 05 17:54:33 * FlyingDragon is now known as FlyingAway
Apr 05 17:54:33 <aldo> Regarding, suit art, yes, I think uploading your image will be the way it will work. The game will provide you with a template
Apr 05 17:54:36 <rimworlder> SB - do you know the X-ball league/format? I have the patent for it, and not a dime from it
Apr 05 17:54:37 <SolBelter> enjot chapter 3 with him!!
Apr 05 17:55:14 <FlyingAway> My original review of SW 3 was "Dead children lying on the floor let my children see I won't." but Keegan wants to see it.
Apr 05 17:55:14 <SolBelter> not a clue re format until i goog... :) sympathy
Apr 05 17:55:45 <rimworlder> SB - they've only made about 30 mil all told
Apr 05 17:56:03 <rimworlder> what's another few million, eh?
Apr 05 17:56:17 <SolBelter> hhooooo boy!
Apr 05 17:56:29 <aldo> Artificial gravity has been a big topic of discussion as we've worked the game details. We're planning to avoid it as much as possible. In other words, artificial gravity will or may be a new technology in the era of the game. It is expensive and doesn't package well for small applications
Apr 05 17:56:42 <FlyingAway> Keegan says to everyone "Bye" (He means I'M saying bye!!!!)
Apr 05 17:56:53 <Lensman> I keep thinking I should actually watch my DVD of SW3, but so far I've only seen it once in the theatre.
Apr 05 17:57:16 <rimworlder> I won't belabor the non KS issue, but lets put it this way: my attorneys in the case (the TOP firm in DC) fired me as a client after they discovered that there WAS a conflict of interest with other clients - who just so happened to be the people who ripped me off
Apr 05 17:57:45 <aldo> I'm gonna have to sign off at around 3:00 pm. Any other questions?
Apr 05 17:58:00 <rimworlder> release date?
Apr 05 17:58:13 <aldo> 3:00 pm west coast time . . .
Apr 05 17:58:25 <Lensman> Aldo: Well I found it amusing that artificial gravity is, according to Larry, the only tech in a game called "Free Fall" which isn't an offshoot of current science/tech... :)
Apr 05 17:58:28 <Fred_of_Worlds> reading back: protector, learned female mannerisms. Of course, if the female mannerisms are a side effect of estrogen, the protector's gonna lose 'em
Apr 05 17:58:35 <Fred_of_Worlds> I'm thinking Bea Arthur here
Apr 05 17:58:43 <rimworlder> lol
Apr 05 17:58:48 <rimworlder> Maude in Space
Apr 05 17:58:49 <SolBelter> i used dickstein moran shapiro [ as spearcarrier for L-5 Moon treaty opposition - i was told they in top six firms then -1979 - any idea?
Apr 05 17:59:03 <aldo> Release date is unkown, We are in selling mode and have close a deal with a game publisher. There